Jeff Hornacek thread

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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby Don Che » February 4, 2018, 5:56 pm

Dumars went 9 and 5 as a 22 year old rookie


I am not worried about Frank
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby big_j_NY » February 4, 2018, 6:07 pm

Don Che wrote:Dumars went 9 and 5 as a 22 year old rookie


I am not worried about Frank


Dumars also played 2-guard as a rookie, so there was zero expectations to run an offense during that time. Frank doesn't have an Isiah Thomas next to him (despite people's demand for more Burke, which I don't disagree with), so this is an unfair comparison.

That being said, I still agree with your last point.........still too early to worry about Frank, who was expected to not do anything in his rookie season.
#EmbraceTheTank2018

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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby taowave » February 4, 2018, 8:35 pm

In no way am I saying Burke is Iverson,but if you remember Eric Snow was a combo guard who was the lockdown defender and quarterback.

I think Big J is right and Frank may not be the dynamic scorer,but he can be the Dumars/Snow type..Not a bad thing.


big_j_NY wrote:The more I think about what you and max are saying, tao...............the more I realize Frank could possibly be more of a "Dumars-type combo guard" that can run the offense in spurts but is better suited as a complementary defensive 2-guard alongside a more "dynamic" lead guard.
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby dcapodic » February 5, 2018, 9:16 am

https://nypost.com/2018/02/05/trey-burke-and-frank-ntilikina-are-heading-opposite-directions/

Maybe this is the reason Jeff has been limiting Frank's minutes.

It could explain a lot of things about his play recently.
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby Don Che » February 5, 2018, 12:11 pm

my main point with Dumars is......you can't over value a non productive rookie season


Dumars didnt set the world on fire as a rookie...and had a hall of fame career

so I'm not gonna go crazy on Frank either...If hes 23 and has these numbers..then you worry
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby maxinquaye11 » February 5, 2018, 1:57 pm

Trey Burke is legit. Not only is he a scorer he is also a suitable defender. Hornacek tanking is the only logical reason why Trey is not playing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30zhW7H7S2Y

and yeah, the perimeter jumper off the p and r reminds me of Kevin Johnson.
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby dcapodic » February 5, 2018, 3:27 pm

Don Che wrote:my main point with Dumars is......you can't over value a non productive rookie season


Dumars didnt set the world on fire as a rookie...and had a hall of fame career

so I'm not gonna go crazy on Frank either...If hes 23 and has these numbers..then you worry


I get what you are saying and agree to an extent. There is a lot more that needs to be looked at when judging a season at any experience level. Thi sis why you can't set any plans or really even fantasize about any assignments for Frank until he shows something....anything :) This is not judging him early, it's being realistic. How can you plan a guys career until you have some indication what he is and will be?!?

The thing is, you mention Dumars and the next thing we see is all of this planning about Frank/Burke being Dumars/Thomas :) Thoughts tend to get out of control pretty fast.

By the way, I would take 9/5 for Frank this year :) He won't be close to those numbers but I get what you are saying. Again, totally different situations though. Dumars came in next to one of the greatest PG's....unfortunately, Frank does not have that luxury .
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby taowave » February 5, 2018, 3:48 pm

DC,when I brought up Dumars/Zeke,my point was if you are going to play Jack and Baker,all is lost...I am starting to lose confidence in Jeff,or bare minimum question his sanity.

Burke has been playing the best ball on this squad since being called up.

61% from the floor,37% from 3,with 3.2 apg and .4 To's per game. Yet he gets a DNP or gets benched :?

I agree with you on Frank.He needs to demonstrate some proficiency,preferably related to Basketball

The guy has had glimpses of potential,but overall has played like dogshit.Kid plays frightened,and perhaps he is better suited as a 2 as he cant/wont penetrate the top of the key.
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby rebound » February 7, 2018, 2:37 am

listen here you phil jackson lackey.

give us

frank
lee
doug
beaz
noer

burke
dotson
lance
oquinn
willy

rest-tim,kanter
dnp-applejack


or gtfo this team
Team Mills
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby Knickyankee3 » February 8, 2018, 7:28 am

In fariness and taking a step back, I think Jeff has been handed an impossible situation. Last year he was undermined by Phil's ego- he tried to bring in uptempo basketball and it worked until Christmas until Phil had to insist on the triangle and Rambis as defensive coach, and Phil coached from the stands. Players soon had no respect for Jeff.
This year its a fresh start, but only to a point- he's still a handover from Phil setting the franchise on fire and he's not the GM's guy, neither Mills or Perry's guy. I think considering this ill conceived roster 4 centres and no good guards in a perimeter shooting athletic league is ridiculous so, he's done better than many would have thought in terms of wins/losses. He's also a good guy, not a great innovative coach that's for sure.
His rotations are just nonsensical and he's coaching for W's instead of the future. He's giving Lance Thomas and his 0 points per night 30+mins a night, he abandoned Willy, he has no idea who to play between Frank and Burke and is riding Jack and giving him obscene minutes most nights. Honestly, we play miserable basketball- its not even good or exciting- its terrible stuff, if you look at other teams in the league- who play with a sense of team and purpose its frankly disgusting stuff.
I'm done with him now- and I'm looking at Mark Jackson after hopefully we lose out the rest of the way this year. Embrace the tank, then get a new coach in with my best wishes. Not a bad guy or a terrible coach, just not the right coach for the franchise. Simple.
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby taowave » February 8, 2018, 8:20 am

Pretty good post :thumbsup:


Knickyankee3 wrote:In fariness and taking a step back, I think Jeff has been handed an impossible situation. Last year he was undermined by Phil's ego- he tried to bring in uptempo basketball and it worked until Christmas until Phil had to insist on the triangle and Rambis as defensive coach, and Phil coached from the stands. Players soon had no respect for Jeff.
This year its a fresh start, but only to a point- he's still a handover from Phil setting the franchise on fire and he's not the GM's guy, neither Mills or Perry's guy. I think considering this ill conceived roster 4 centres and no good guards in a perimeter shooting athletic league is ridiculous so, he's done better than many would have thought in terms of wins/losses. He's also a good guy, not a great innovative coach that's for sure.
His rotations are just nonsensical and he's coaching for W's instead of the future. He's giving Lance Thomas and his 0 points per night 30+mins a night, he abandoned Willy, he has no idea who to play between Frank and Burke and is riding Jack and giving him obscene minutes most nights. Honestly, we play miserable basketball- its not even good or exciting- its terrible stuff, if you look at other teams in the league- who play with a sense of team and purpose its frankly disgusting stuff.
I'm done with him now- and I'm looking at Mark Jackson after hopefully we lose out the rest of the way this year. Embrace the tank, then get a new coach in with my best wishes. Not a bad guy or a terrible coach, just not the right coach for the franchise. Simple.
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby nazrmohamed » February 8, 2018, 8:33 am

See, I knew his little had would surface. Mark Jackson. Please no. Just get David Blatt
PHISHER
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Re: Jeff Hornacek thread

Postby Don Che » February 8, 2018, 8:41 am

its funny that some ppl bash Jeff for losing....while they are the same guys that want us to lose for a draft pick.

This team was never good enough on paper to make the playoffs....we were around 10-13 pick material...w/o KP tho...we are 1-3.

Its hard to evaluate any coach in those situations....at the same time the unhappiness of Noah and Willy, even tho its due to the roster make up...it does seem like Jeff isnt good at communicating with his players and that can be a problem once we have a playoff roster.
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