2017 NBA trade rumors (3 team deal Cavs, Kings, and Utah)

[shakespeare]

Ainge gave one of the best perimeter defenders away for next to nothing.

[spree#8]

Ainge gave one of the best perimeter defenders away for next to nothing.

He had a glut at the 2 and 3 and needed a bigman, so I wouldn't call Morris nothing. He is also still on a cap friendly contract for two years, while Bradley will want to get paid next summer. With Hayward and probably soon one of Tatum/Brown moving into the starting line-up, the deal makes some sense to me.

[dcapodic]

He had a glut at the 2 and 3 and needed a bigman, so I wouldn't call Morris nothing. He is also still on a cap friendly contract for two years, while Bradley will want to get paid next summer. With Hayward and probably soon one of Tatum/Brown moving into the starting line-up, the deal makes some sense to me.

The thing about this is that except for a few bucks he didn't have to make this deal. He did not manage this well. Is the deal horrible, no but I would rather have Bradley and the pick than Morris so the only sense was to get under the threshold to sign Hayward so I give him an F for money management in the Hayword deal.

[spree#8]

The thing about this is that except for a few bucks he didn't have to make this deal. He did not manage this well. Is the deal horrible, no but I would rather have Bradley and the pick than Morris so the only sense was to get under the threshold to sign Hayward so I give him an F for money management in the Hayword deal.

The point is that he had to make a move from a guard to a big regardless of the few bucks he saved. He also made a decision not to overpay Bradley next summer, so for the Celtics this deal makes sense. Is it the best they could get? No idea, but the concept is sound, because Bradley wouldn't have had the big role going forward for the Celtics.

BTW, Bradley's defense wasn't what it used to be in 2016-17: http://www.espn.com.au/blog/boston/celt ... fense-team

Some analysis of the trade: http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/1990 ... ping-guard
And some grades: https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-free-agenc ... 57410.html

[shakespeare]

needed a bigman

A big man? Morris is not known for his shot blocking nor rebounding which, in my humble opinion, determines a big man.

Isn't Horford (scheduled to make $28 million next season) still on the team?

[Boston_PuppyDawg]

Toronto has traded DeMarre Carroll, a future first-round and second-round pick to Brooklyn for Justin Hamilton, league sources tell ESPN.

[dcapodic]

Toronto has traded DeMarre Carroll, a future first-round and second-round pick to Brooklyn for Justin Hamilton, league sources tell ESPN.

Gotta feel like the Nets management team is doing all they can to try and make lemonade outta lemons. Even with their own picks gone, they are coming up with ways to find first rounders (albeit less attractive ones that their own).

It is gonna take a while, but why do I feel like the Nets are really moving in the right direction. Could it be because they are doing this rebuild right?!? Hire the best young assistant to be your pres./GM, who hires an experienced and hungry assistant to be the coach, do whatever you can to get picks, etc, etc.

Yea, they are gonna stink for a while but gotta appreciate what a good front office can do when they have a plan.

Yup, they made one of the worst trades in modern times but after that disaster washes itself out they look to be set on the right path.

[Koopa Troopa]

Ainge gave one of the best perimeter defenders away for next to nothing.

Wouldnt even say just that. Bradley was the heart and soul of that team. Team morale definitely gonna drop....business is business but I dunno, Ainge might be ing up.

Even if you just HAD to trade Bradley cause you couldnt pay him next year (which just shows an inability to manage money)...this is an awful package. Does Ainge realize who he traded? If I was a Celts fan I couldnt imagine how pissed id be, im mad and im a got damn new yorker


They traded this guy

Stan Van Gundy making Ainge look dumb

[spree#8]

A big man? Morris is not known for his shot blocking nor rebounding which, in my humble opinion, determines a big man.

Isn't Horford (scheduled to make $28 million next season) still on the team?

Bigger than Bradley, able to play the 4. Better balance to the roster. Optimal yet? Nope, but better than before. They have to build up Brown or Tatum into a future star at 2 or 3, have IT at the 1 and Hayward at the 2 or 3. So where does Bradley at 17-22 per year fit in there? Nowhere. They also still have Smart, so the minutes at 1-3 are covered by those five guys and of course they still can add depth to their bench (which BTW got easier through this trade because instead of the needed 300k they saved over 3 mill). It just makes too much sense. As I said before: whether Morris is the best they could get? I don't know. But trading Bradley is the sound strategy here.

From another forum here the ESPN insider analysis from Kevin Pelton:

The deal
Celtics get: Forward Marcus Morris

Pistons get: Guard Avery Bradley, 2019 second-round pick


Boston Celtics: B+
By all accounts, Boston president of basketball operations and GM Danny Ainge loves Bradley's game, so despite the fact that Bradley was entering the final season of his contract and due a big raise, I believed the Celtics would never trade him instead of Jae Crowder or Marcus Smart to clear the cap space necessary to sign Gordon Hayward to the max contract he agreed to earlier this week. I was wrong.

From a purely rational standpoint, there was an overwhelming case that Bradley was the best option. Crowder has one of the league's best contracts, one that pays him an average of $7.3 million over the next three seasons. And while Smart is also in the final year of his deal, he'll be a restricted free agent next summer, allowing Boston to control the process and potentially keep down his salary. (He's also more than three years younger than Bradley.)

By contrast, Bradley will be an unrestricted free agent next summer, and was likely to draw heavy interest around the league. In particular, I suspect the Philadelphia 76ers' strategy of agreeing to lucrative one-year contracts this summer with J.J. Redick and Amir Johnson was made with an eye toward making Bradley their top priority next summer.

In the worst-case scenario, the Celtics would have lost two of their core players (one by trade, Bradley by free agency). The best-case option had them paying Bradley more than $20 million a year, a move that in conjunction with re-signing All-Star point guard Isaiah Thomas would have pushed them deep into the luxury tax for the foreseeable future.

While Morris' contract isn't nearly as favorable as Crowder's -- he's not in Crowder's class as a player and has just two years remaining at his below-market rate ($5 million this season, $5.4 million in 2018-19) instead of three -- it's still far, far cheaper than Bradley's would have been next summer. The Celtics will likely pay Morris and Smart less in 2018-19 than they would have paid Bradley all by himself.

Still, there's a reason Bradley is so coveted. Boston doesn't have anyone else on its deep roster who can both effectively defend the guard spots -- if perhaps not as well as his reputation suggests, since Bradley's team defense isn't as strong as his one-on-one ability -- and space the floor. That combination of skills is particularly valuable among the league's better teams (Bradley tends to give the Golden State Warriors' guards difficulty), a level of competition the Celtics now need to consider.

Trading Bradley puts pressure on Smart to become a capable enough 3-point shooter to stay on the court late in games and deep in the playoffs. Boston will need him in a large role as a perimeter stopper -- and he does tend to rate much better than Bradley by defensive metrics because he is an active help defender in addition to providing quality one-on-one defense.

From a positional standpoint, this deal may align the Celtics better. Losing Crowder would have been problematic because Boston didn't have anyone else to play power forward when Al Horford moves to center, Brad Stevens' likely finishing alignment. Now, both Crowder and Morris are options there. Both versatile combo forwards can defend guards and big men, just like Smart and reserve Jaylen Brown, meaning the Celtics may rely more on a switch-heavy defense than lockdown individual D.

Had this trade been made a month ago, I would have expected Boston to get the extra pick instead of Detroit. (According to Shams Charania of the Vertical, it's the Celtics' 2019 second-round pick, which is likely to fall at the end of the draft.) But Boston did face some pressure to get a deal done now that room was needed to sign Hayward. Given that limitation, the Celtics did well.

Pistons: D
One of the reasons for Boston to make this move was the possibility of losing two contributors to get one. That's exactly the scenario the Pistons now face. Dealing Morris, who started all 79 games he played last season, for Bradley also almost certainly means moving on from starting shooting guard Kentavious Caldwell-Pope.

Because Detroit split its non-taxpayer midlevel exception on guard Langston Galloway and big man Eric Moreland, the team is hard-capped at the apron $6 million above the luxury-tax line. Without getting off other salary, the largest offer sheet the Pistons could now match to Caldwell-Pope as a restricted free agent would start around $15.7 million. And Detroit couldn't fill out its roster while paying Caldwell-Pope more than about $13 million. As a result, ESPN's Brian Windhorst has reported the team may just pull Caldwell-Pope's offer sheet and allow him to become an unrestricted free agent.

I suppose there's some chance the interest in Caldwell-Pope is so tepid that he simply returns for his one-year qualifying offer to try his case as an unrestricted free agent next summer. But Bradley's arrival means fewer minutes for Caldwell-Pope, whose skill set is broadly similar. He'll almost certainly take whatever he can get as a restricted free agent.

So the Pistons have probably lost two starters to get one ... and that one can be an unrestricted free agent in 12 months. At best, they've just kicked their luxury-tax concerns down the road a year, since re-signing Bradley would push them deep into the tax in 2018-19. (Detroit may find it easier to move other players for tax relief with a year less on their deals, it should be noted.) At worst, the Pistons gave up two years of Morris at a good price for one with Bradley.

In order for that deal to make sense, Bradley would have to be a substantial upgrade on Caldwell-Pope. I'm not convinced that's the case. Bradley is a better 3-point shooter (39.0 percent last season and 36.6 percent career vs. 35.0 percent last season and 33.4 percent career for Caldwell-Pope), but their box-score stats are otherwise broadly similar. And, as noted, advanced metrics haven't supported the notion that Bradley is an elite defender. I think they somewhat understate his value, which is somewhere in the very good range. Caldwell-Pope isn't far off that.

As the Celtics are counting on Smart to step up, Detroit is putting pressure on third-year forward Stanley Johnson. The Pistons relied heavily on the trio of Morris, Tobias Harris and Jon Leuer at forward last season. With Morris' departure, Johnson ascends into that group, whether he ends up starting or not. (Detroit could start Harris and Leuer and bring Johnson off the bench to replace either player.)

Through two seasons, Johnson has been far too inefficient to fill that role, which is why he briefly ended up out of Stan Van Gundy's rotation last year. If Johnson proves a major downgrade from Morris at forward, it may offset the improvement at shooting guard and leave the Pistons on the fringes of the Eastern Conference playoff race with Bradley's free agency looming.

[StevoStarks]

I'm with Koopa on this - do not like that trade at all.

[Boston_PuppyDawg]

Toronto is finalizing a sign-and-trade with Indiana to move Cory Joseph for CJ Miles, league sources tell ESPN.

[Boston_PuppyDawg]

Toronto has traded DeMarre Carroll, a future first-round and second-round pick to Brooklyn for Justin Hamilton, league sources tell ESPN.

I agree dcap in they are moving in the right direction...that trade is something the Knicks could've have done to gain some more picks and absorb the cap space and at the same time obtained a younger piece

[dcapodic]

I agree dcap in they are moving in the right direction...that trade is something the Knicks could've have done to gain some more picks and absorb the cap space and at the same time obtained a younger piece

So far, they have gotten a first and second rounder. Let's keep an eye on this near the trade deadline. By that time, Carroll will only have 1+ years left on his contract and if he is healthy, he is the kinda player that a playoff team could want to pick up.

I wouldn't be surprised at all to see him turn into another pick.

[Boston_PuppyDawg]

Cleveland and Boston engaged in active trade discussions centered on Kyrie Irving and Isaiah Thomas, league sources tell The Vertical.

[Boston_PuppyDawg]

Sources: Boston, Cleveland nearing deal on Kyrie Irving, but details still working to completion. Isaiah Thomas, Crowder, pick(s) in talks.

[Boston_PuppyDawg]

Boston center Ante Zizic also expected to be part of a potential Cleveland deal for Kyrie Irving, league sources tell ESPN.

[StevoStarks]

Good move for both teams I guess. I just hate that a guy like Thomas, who won over the city of Boston and had a magical season last year for the Celtics, can be shipped out the next year so they can get Kyrie. I get that Kyrie is the younger, arguably better, player. But it just sucks that there's no loyalty, no roots between the players and the teams they play for.

[Boston_PuppyDawg]

Cavs and Celtics on verge of a deal: Kyrie Irving for Isaiah Thomas, Jae Crowder, Ante Zizic and 2018 Nets pick unprotected, sources say

[StevoStarks]

The inclusion of the Nets 2018 pick would have made me pull out if I'm Boston. Feels Zeke-ish by throwing that in.

Cleveland won this in my opinion and are already doing a good job preparing for life without Bron next year.

[Boston_PuppyDawg]

Sources: Boston, Cleveland on trade call now with league office. Deal is done.